Pick some who Should be on the Ballot

[Rosco3387]

Was that before or after? Wonder if there was some sentimentality to the vote.

So what is the Hall of Fame?

Isn't it really just about honoring the fighters we want to remember.

I don't know... I have some pretty strong opinions about the ethical process involved with deciding though. Pete Rose was the only person ever to involve ******** on his team winning ever that was a great player... Even though baseball was a virtual haven for every athletic near do well across Murica! Go figure!

These organizations become very politically minded and often want to teach kids not to do things like gamble, or drugs, as much as teach kids about the true range of characters in the sports they love... But then again Gatti beat his wife, along with many other fighters and is in...

I know the sports are different but the lack of consistency is troubling. Wife beaters ok, gamblers not so ok. Nobody has the faintest idea about all the chicanory involved in any of these sports and great players... We want to start taking scalps: best start somewhere where we aint throwin the baby out with the bath water... Enhanced performance? anyone? wife beaters? inveterate gamblers?

So... I am not a fan of any of the HOF organizations.

[Rosco3387]

True. So where do you draw the imaginary line? Participation percentage? Stringent criteria or lax celebration of the sport's best, or something in between? Not a cinch mapping sound criteria in this thing. Don't leave it up to me. I see these retired fighters all the time, all the bitterness flushed out of them years ago; the most approachable and pleasant star athletes there are anywhere, and when I'm asked the question I'm like I am at the animal shelter looking over all the great dogs that need a home. "Load em' all up". Honoring warriors, be they soldiers who sacrificed something of themselves for the quality of life we enjoy or Ringmen who did the same for their families and for our amusement; it's the wrong time to be stingy. This doesn't cheapen the shrine of Canastota. It grows it's reach in Honoring the best of the art.

You rough & tumble? You kick and grapple I push your eye in and bite your face; first shank in or weapon drawn wins it? Means nothing. But a boxing fight? Like Apollo did it. That’s meaningful, can pay big too; and those we honor . Just as many as you please. But the next 5 who are at the front of the queue????? That's the question posed.

Sorry Wisp I adressed this in a response to Pep. Ill put it this way: Discussing ATG's is fruitful imo, but HOF? No real interest.

[QueensburyRules]

I don't know... I have some pretty strong opinions about the ethical process involved with deciding though. Pete Rose was the only person ever to involve ******** on his team winning ever that was a great player... Even though baseball was a virtual haven for every athletic near do well across Murica! Go figure!

These organizations become very politically minded and often want to teach kids not to do things like gamble, or drugs, as much as teach kids about the true range of characters in the sports they love... But then again Gatti beat his wife, along with many other fighters and is in...

I know the sports are different but the lack of consistency is troubling. Wife beaters ok, gamblers not so ok. Nobody has the faintest idea about all the chicanory involved in any of these sports and great players... We want to start taking scalps: best start somewhere where we aint throwin the baby out with the bath water... Enhanced performance? anyone? wife beaters? inveterate gamblers?

So... I am not a fan of any of the HOF organizations.

- - It's a subjective beauty contest like U top fighter lists.

MLB Baseball was rife with ******** from inception. It took new commish Judge Landis to clean it up ca post 1919, but his way was hamhanded butchery.

Today with top players touching 1/3 Billion in career earnings and even reliable scrubs can clear 10 mil, no money made in ******** is worth that golden harvest they already have.

What makes Boxing so ******** notable is Commishes have failed to address the problem where a Judge or Ref can make 100x what he would normally clear in a match. Archie Moore a HOF fighter turned pro in a no $$$ era of Depression, WW2, and post WW2 recession $$$. When he fought young Clay who predicted 4 rounds, Arch conveniently fell in for for much more than his limited purse for that fight.

Nobodhwith any sense gonna blame Archie though. Rose had MLB warnings against ******** in every league clubhouse got to be bigger than MLB to flaunt his ********, thus his downfall. Willie Mays and Mickey Mantle post retirement were cozy with gamblers and were suspended from MLB events for a year or two. Thus MLB has a much better business model than boxing who caters primarily to lowbrow fans who are easily duped.

[JAB5239]

- - It's a subjective beauty contest like U top fighter lists.

MLB Baseball was rife with ******** from inception. It took new commish Judge Landis to clean it up ca post 1919, but his way was hamhanded butchery.

Today with top players touching 1/3 Billion in career earnings and even reliable scrubs can clear 10 mil, no money made in ******** is worth that golden harvest they already have.

What makes Boxing so ******** notable is Commishes have failed to address the problem where a Judge or Ref can make 100x what he would normally clear in a match. Archie Moore a HOF fighter turned pro in a no $$$ era of Depression, WW2, and post WW2 recession $$$. When he fought young Clay who predicted 4 rounds, Arch conveniently fell in for for much more than his limited purse for that fight.

Nobodhwith any sense gonna blame Archie though. Rose had MLB warnings against ******** in every league clubhouse got to be bigger than MLB to flaunt his ********, thus his downfall. Willie Mays and Mickey Mantle post retirement were cozy with gamblers and were suspended from MLB events for a year or two. Thus MLB has a much better business model than boxing who caters primarily to lowbrow fans who are easily duped.

And you have proof of this, right? Wait a second.....of course you don't. You make things up all the time with nothing to support it at all.

[Willie Pep 229]

And you have proof of this, right? Wait a second.....of course you don't. You make things up all the time with nothing to support it at all.

Your correct he probably doesn't.

But I'll tell you, the way fighters often got (and get) abused by promoters, managers, and commissions, I always like to believe that at the end of their careers they do in fact go cross to pick up few dollars more.

In short, I hope it's true. I hope Archie gave four rounds and laid down for a few extra dollars from the Louisville syndication.

[Willow The Wisp]

I don't know... I have some pretty strong opinions about the ethical process involved with deciding though. Pete Rose was the only person ever to involve ******** on his team winning ever that was a great player... Even though baseball was a virtual haven for every athletic near do well across Murica! Go figure!

These organizations become very politically minded and often want to teach kids not to do things like gamble, or drugs, as much as teach kids about the true range of characters in the sports they love... But then again Gatti beat his wife, along with many other fighters and is in...

I know the sports are different but the lack of consistency is troubling. Wife beaters ok, gamblers not so ok. Nobody has the faintest idea about all the chicanory involved in any of these sports and great players... We want to start taking scalps: best start somewhere where we aint throwin the baby out with the bath water... Enhanced performance? anyone? wife beaters? inveterate gamblers?

So... I am not a fan of any of the HOF organizations.

Good post and sound thinking IMO. I would only have a retort for the last line, as all of these HOF shrines provide something extraordinary and meaningful. I beleive this firmly, but do very much embrace your beliefs expressed beyond not being a fan of any of the HOF organizations, which itself might be claimed an example of throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

[Willow The Wisp]

I see combat sports as the only sport that is neither a game nor a stunt. I see them as the toughest of all sports. I've traveled extensively and been blessed indeed to have known people of many stripes in varying fields (as most of us have), many in positions garnering wide respect and influence. Those who get MY deepest respect are the ones who venture where most will not tread, and shine brightly as they do so.

I'm asking each of you if you get that?

So, to a group of boxing fans, the International Boxing Hall of Fame should NOT be a hard sell.

If you ever would go for an induction week, perhaps as a sidebar to a visit to NYC if you're traveling, you'd learn something important about the sport you love. Some that you can learn nowhere else in the world. And it's cheap!


That's my promise.

It's not just the inductees. It's the many, many lesser lights / Non inductees walking around, all smiles at the discovery of being remembered. Sitting down in Graziano's and Gerry Cooney and George Chuvalo come sit with you because it's crowded and you've got seats, just to talk Boxing.....Carlos Zarate joins you, then Rock-a-bye Ruben Olivares and Pipino Cuavas. The food is good, the drinks are too, and there's a little commotion because Duran or Leonard or the Klitschko Brothers have just entered the place and they walk around saying hello.....this is NOT Cooperstown, Canton or Springfield.

[Rosco3387]

- - It's a subjective beauty contest like U top fighter lists.

MLB Baseball was rife with ******** from inception. It took new commish Judge Landis to clean it up ca post 1919, but his way was hamhanded butchery.

Today with top players touching 1/3 Billion in career earnings and even reliable scrubs can clear 10 mil, no money made in ******** is worth that golden harvest they already have.

What makes Boxing so ******** notable is Commishes have failed to address the problem where a Judge or Ref can make 100x what he would normally clear in a match. Archie Moore a HOF fighter turned pro in a no $$$ era of Depression, WW2, and post WW2 recession $$$. When he fought young Clay who predicted 4 rounds, Arch conveniently fell in for for much more than his limited purse for that fight.

Nobodhwith any sense gonna blame Archie though. Rose had MLB warnings against ******** in every league clubhouse got to be bigger than MLB to flaunt his ********, thus his downfall. Willie Mays and Mickey Mantle post retirement were cozy with gamblers and were suspended from MLB events for a year or two. Thus MLB has a much better business model than boxing who caters primarily to lowbrow fans who are easily duped.

Absolutely... Rose was a bigmouth for lack of a better term and an easy scapegoat. Like you say, players traditionally earned peanuts, and IMO baseball was practically a chain gang lol.

[Rosco3387]

Good post and sound thinking IMO. I would only have a retort for the last line, as all of these HOF shrines provide something extraordinary and meaningful. I beleive this firmly, but do very much embrace your beliefs expressed beyond not being a fan of any of the HOF organizations, which itself might be claimed an example of throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

Any great fan of a sport should go deeper than the opinions of the punditry that determines a HOF birth... To really determine the natural hitting ability of Rod Carew or Ted Williams is a contemplation of physics, human body mechanics, etc... To appreciate Dimaggio's record, how difficult that record was to achieve... these things are just beyond HOF.

And so it is for boxing... What appealed to average fans and the sports vanity is merely a veil imo.

[QueensburyRules]

And you have proof of this, right? Wait a second.....of course you don't. You make things up all the time with nothing to support it at all.

- - Last I checked U emptied all my 100 proof bottles.

Moral- Throw neither pearls nor 100 proof bottles before swine.