Great fighters who never dominated a particular weight class when compared to fellow ATG fighters, But where dominant, where do we put them?

[billeau2]

Hopkins is being discussed in another thread. Hopkins is a perfect example of a great fighter who did his greatest work at different weight classes. You see this type of great fighter when a guy had a long career or, just was able to fight up in weight. Archie Moore is an example of the former, Gene Tunney of the latter.

The problem is these guys often defy being listed as an ATG at any particular weight class. So, while we can say "Michael Spinks was one of the greatest light heavies" does this make him better than someone like Usyk who was a phenominal light heavy but whom has split his professional time as a legitimate heavy weight contender? Spinks can be compared to other great light heavies, but fighers like Michael Moore, Archie Moore, and Usyk the comparison does not reflect their abilites as a whole. EVEN a great fighter like Archie Moore, or Ray Robinson, we still have to split their resume when comparing in a single division. Again... Andre Ward: fought up but basically fought his career and best as a middle weight, so when throwing his name in for ATG status he gets the benefit of having his best work considered *... Even a fighter like Holyfield suffers because some of his best work was split between divisions.

So where do we put these "Ronin" fighters when making our "lists?"

*Ward foughtb about 80% or so as a middleweight as I figure it.

[DeeMoney]

I always dig this topic. I tend to favor fighters who dominate a given weight class as opposed to those who are weight class nomads (though are dominant in their own right). That fits with my tendency to favor peak greatness over longevity though.

And while I get the argument of evaluating someone as being great because they are able to move up through various classes, I am more impressed with one who can be the most dominant at their very best- which tends to be those who end up being great in a specific weight class. As such, I tend to rank fighters like Monzon & Hagler higher than most. I couldn't care less that they did all their work in one class; I have my logic for that, but don't want to pirate the thread with it.

To me, greatness is first defined by how great you are at your peak (usually 5-7 years), and that greatness is relative to the weight class you are choosing to fight in. In light of that, movement between classes does not matter, as long as you are able to make the weight then thats where you chose to be.

[QueensburyRules]

Hopkins is being discussed in another thread. Hopkins is a perfect example of a great fighter who did his greatest work at different weight classes. You see this type of great fighter when a guy had a long career or, just was able to fight up in weight. Archie Moore is an example of the former, Gene Tunney of the latter.

The problem is these guys often defy being listed as an ATG at any particular weight class. So, while we can say "Michael Spinks was one of the greatest light heavies" does this make him better than someone like Usyk who was a phenominal light heavy but whom has split his professional time as a legitimate heavy weight contender? Spinks can be compared to other great light heavies, but fighers like Michael Moore, Archie Moore, and Usyk the comparison does not reflect their abilites as a whole. EVEN a great fighter like Archie Moore, or Ray Robinson, we still have to split their resume when comparing in a single division. Again... Andre Ward: fought up but basically fought his career and best as a middle weight, so when throwing his name in for ATG status he gets the benefit of having his best work considered *... Even a fighter like Holyfield suffers because some of his best work was split between divisions.

So where do we put these "Ronin" fighters when making our "lists?"

*Ward foughtb about 80% or so as a middleweight as I figure it.

- - I figure Wart vs Popkins might stink so bad as to be called off so authorities could evacuate the dead and dying inhalant victims of their farce.

Manny ended up dominating welter without dominating the previous 7 weight classes he passed through while dominating the Ring p4p ratings from flyweight forward.

[IronDanHamza]

Probably Pacquaio and Mayweather are examples of this in the modern day.

Despite having extended success at certain weights they never stayed around for long until they hit their maximum (147)