PBC has TONS of money in the bank

[Eff Pandas]

ok, so you can't comprehend what people write.

You didn't answer my question & said:

i don't want to discuss with anyone.

So sounded like you weren't going to answer my question.

So whats a good fight before June thats not PBC?

[bballchump11]

it is not, what is a good fight for you?
Fanny Farceia vs Guerrero?

LOL

Jermall Charlo vs Austin Trout is a really good fight. Badou Jack vs Bute is a really good fight.
Rodriguez vs Williams is a good fight. Rodriguez should win by KO, but they may exchange some knockdowns on the way there.

[Eff Pandas]

A simple example; Terrence "Bud" Crawford is supposed to be one of those "next guy up" stars for boxing.

Crawford is doing really good business in his home market, he's got a style that (once he gets warmed up) makes for good TV and, though not the most charismatic guy, is the kind of wholesome good guy that the HBO hype machine can build up.

I have no idea what type of money it ended up costing to stage Crawford-Postol, but HBO should've bit that bullet, to showcase Crawford in front of the 1m+ homes he could've gotten for HBO World Championship Boxing, rather than the maybe 100k homes that are likely expected to pony up for PPV right now.

It sounds like that fight wasn't deemed within their budget or profitable via PPV thus its a TR PPV now from my understanding. If the dollars don't make sense I don't think you just bit the bullet in every case. I got serious questions about Crawford become some sort of PPV star or even the face of HBO. Maybe HBO does to thus this risk didn't make sense to them.

Competition level of the fights is secondary, tbh; if HBO is truly going with this "build-a-superstar" approach, they need to identify the guys that they're seeking to push and put up the money for those guys (note: the fact that HBO has decided to go with utter mismatches, however, likely means that folks will take far longer to develop into potential PPV stars, as seen in Golovkin's 9 HBO fights yet still no consideration for PPV by the audience).

Saul 'Canelo' Alvarez is basically a PPV attraction at this point; HBO should identify the next four guys they think are PPV, budget $6m a year to broadcast each guy [total boxing budget of $25m], and let things play themselves out.

Golovkin[K2], Kovalev[Main Events], Crawford[Top Rank], and an open slot [penciling in Alvarez's non-PPV shows and the limited commitment to Andre Ward going forward] as HBO's boxing schedule; hopefully the few companies that get money in the new setup can leverage the HBO money to bring along young prospects for the next phase (after the four guys focused on either move onto PPV or get washed out in defeat).

I mean okay that'd be your plan, but maybe HBO has there own way of doing things that they've had some success with over the last 40 years. I just don't think they are "improperly investing" in boxing cuz they aren't doing things in a way you deem correct.

[The Gambler1981]

It sounds like that fight wasn't deemed within their budget or profitable via PPV thus its a TR PPV now from my understanding. If the dollars don't make sense I don't think you just bit the bullet in every case. I got serious questions about Crawford become some sort of PPV star or even the face of HBO. Maybe HBO does to thus this risk didn't make sense to them.



I mean okay that'd be your plan, but maybe HBO has there own way of doing things that they've had some success with over the last 40 years. I just don't think they are "improperly investing" in boxing cuz they aren't doing things in a way you deem correct.

Except HBO's plan the last 30 years was essentially to be the big **** in the room and have your way with no real care for the rest of the landscape. that is no longer the environment they are operating in. If they continue to operate like things are the same they will be in the past. They have to adapt to a new environment if they care to survive.

IBM exists because they changed from a computer company to a business service company, Kodak did not survive because they stayed a camera and film company in a world that was changing to digital with a camera in every phone. Is HBO going to be IBM or Kodak in relation to boxing.

[The Gambler1981]

I would assume PBC is still well capitalized though because things have gone the only way they could go and they could have gone no other way. Starting out a sports league is going to cost big money, and no one in their right mind would have expected "Hey let's throw boxing on TV and we are going to count the money rolling in". There is great reward possible but only if they can reach that point, anyone funding PBC would know this and would have to be aware that short and even medium term pain is the cost of the venture along with the risk of total failure with some other group picking up the pieces for pennies on the dollar.

Also they don't have to buy TV time currently, that money was already spent so naturally the burn rate is lower currently. If they have to do that extensively again they already failed.

[Eff Pandas]

Except HBO's plan the last 30 years was essentially to be the big **** in the room and have your way with no real care for the rest of the landscape. that is no longer the environment they are operating in. If they continue to operate like things are the same they will be in the past. They have to adapt to a new environment if they care to survive.

IBM exists because they changed from a computer company to a business service company, Kodak did not survive because they stayed a camera and film company in a world that was changing to digital with a camera in every phone. Is HBO going to be IBM or Kodak in relation to boxing.

Yea I can't really disagree with this at all. When you got a $120M budget vs a $25M or whatever budget they got now you need to be more resourceful. I just think HBO is overall good for the sport is all I'm saying & they aren't "improperly" using their much smaller bankroll. And it seems like they made a decision that Crawford vs Postol wasn't a fight that would be worth it & based on Scorpio's 100k estimation of the buys that arguably wasn't a bad decision.

[PK3434]

Just curious, but what is your proof that W&R was 'irresponsible' and in fact did not expect this? It is on record that they expect losses early on in this venture, so please explain how you've determined that they were not 'checking and scrutinizing everything'.

Thank you in advance.

No proof....Just like there is no proof on basically every statement in this entire forum. However, it is an educated assumption on my part, that whoever was handling the PBC account from Waddell & Reed was not very thorough. I gave one example, but there are many other obvious ones.

And expecting heavy short term losses is not the same as throwing money away...You always try to minimize the expected losses.

[The Gambler1981]

Yea I can't really disagree with this at all. When you got a $120M budget vs a $25M or whatever budget they got now you need to be more resourceful. I just think HBO is overall good for the sport is all I'm saying & they aren't "improperly" using their much smaller bankroll. And it seems like they made a decision that Crawford vs Postol wasn't a fight that would be worth it & based on Scorpio's 100k estimation of the buys that arguably wasn't a bad decision.

I don't want HBO to go away, but a lot of the problems with the sport are because HBO had this approach and would take their ball and go home if they didn't get their way.

So I want to see them change their ways in a meaningful fashion that would benefit them and the sport at large. Now HBO is out for HBO and expecting them to put boxing first above their own interests is not being real, but there are ways to have their cake and eat it also. The Crawford decision was a reasonable one in relation to PPV but that is like a $2.5 million fight (big but not insane) with HBO guys, it could be a pretty boring fight but it is pretty meaningful if HBO can't work that out for their network without PPV that just shows how far they have fallen.

If HBO can't adapt or change it's ways to this new normal, then it is just a matter of when not if. If they can adapt and make it work good for them though, any capital put into boxing is good for boxing.

[nacho daddy]

Isn't it hilarious that so many media clowns were speculating that PBC spent over $400 million in less than a year based on a ****** Reddit post.

Now this new lawsuit against W&R states that PBC was backed with not $500 million but $925 million!

The writing is on the wall, PBC is just getting started.

HBO Boxing is fading and will fade at an alarming pace with so many sub-par PPV events and mismatches.

there is a lot of money in drugs I say that is where the money comes from they are washing it

[Scipio2009]

It sounds like that fight wasn't deemed within their budget or profitable via PPV thus its a TR PPV now from my understanding. If the dollars don't make sense I don't think you just bit the bullet in every case. I got serious questions about Crawford become some sort of PPV star or even the face of HBO. Maybe HBO does to thus this risk didn't make sense to them.



I mean okay that'd be your plan, but maybe HBO has there own way of doing things that they've had some success with over the last 40 years. I just don't think they are "improperly investing" in boxing cuz they aren't doing things in a way you deem correct.

HBO's "way of doing things" is no longer viable because they're no longer the outlet with the big checkbook, carrying and not carrying fights on their own whim. If they're no longer willing to put up the money to be 'HBO Boxing', the model inherently has to change.

With the end of the Mike Tyson era (Lewis basically ended things in 2002, but Showtime was still able to utilize Tyson for another year or so); Showtime had to find another way to keep their boxing business going with HBO taking over the marquee.

Rather than simply be HBO-lite, Showtime went another way; international fights, tough matchups with fighters/at weight classes that don't get the glamour, developing hard-scrabble prospects, the introduction of tournaments, taking on the fights that HBO had no interest in that were still good fights, etc.

They were able to re-establish their own boxing identity, and do so with the budget that they had.

HBO's gonna have to re-invent themselves, and I don't think defaulting to PPV and 20:1 fights on TV will do it (though, admittedly, I'll be tuning in for every Andre Ward fight, and am on the verge of committing to head out for Alvarez-Khan; have ignored the rest of the HBO schedule so far, and don't see that changing).