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[BigZ44]

Liverpool definitely more exciting to watch than Man City and more scary imo. City's ridiculous depth and ability to hold the ball against anyone make them perfectly built for sustained success over a long season, but Liverpool is much more frightening on any individual day. Just clinical finishers and feels like they can always beat you in a different way. City you at least always know what you are getting into, let them kick it around for 75 minutes and throw 25 shots over goal and hit them with a couple counters and you can beat them or at least ****house them to a murder/suicide 0-0. Liverpool is a joy to watch as a neutral, but I hate playing them, probably the only team in the PL that I always feel like is a 100% loss when I see them, just always expect them to find a way to pull out a win.

[StarshipTrooper]

I've gone to the same amount of games as you this season! But he's not someone who gets vilified really from my friends and family. He just seems pretty meh doesn't he?

I thought he was gonna be good. That thing he does when he pins defenders was useful until that passing lane got blocked and then he is basically a statue occupying two defenders and hoping it creates space. A job that could have been done by much cheaper player.

However, realistically whilst teams set up a certain way against City and Liverpool they also do the same vs Chelsea. There is no space in behind, crosses into the box can get goals but the likelihood is that 9 defenders will be able to knock it away. So what you really need is quick give and goes, players being able to beat players in tight spaces or be able to find a pass, and certainly players who have great technique and touch and also are able to press defenders and lead a press.

Chelsea have that striker now in Havertz I think. Who for us has the USP of being 6'3 and able to head a football. He has things to learn but I dont doubt him at all now.

Hindsight is 20/20 and Werner was relatively cheap but himself and Lukaku are bad fits. Werner probably will score a lot of goals for a team allowed to play on the counter. Lukaku the same. Werner proved that vs Soton. At the same time he hit both posts and the cross bar so he also showed us why I doubt maybe outside of Bayern Munich he will thrive at a big team. He will always let the team down in a big moment consistently.

The issue is..

Brentford shocker aside. Nobody does sh.it against Chelsea outside of the top 2. Once in a blue moon one of them s.hithouses a cheap and undeserved victory - I'm not buying into all the money bags stuff of old - all these teams have good budgets the lack of ambition of most of them is a joke but understandable.

Soton forgot themselves with Chelsea getting pumped twice in a weak pressed high and got predictably whacked and were lucky not to lose 10 nil at least.

But the usual opposition set up doesnt necessitate a physical striker. There is a bunch of defenders who will want a wrestle.

Hence why Pep and Klopp have long since abandoned strikers. Kane apart who is more of a 9.5 type. No really a traditional striker. In fact Havertz is more of a traditional English centre forward than Kane because be will actually stay further up the pitch.

Chelsea to challenge if they are bought will need some attackers. Replacing your Werner's and Lukaku's with technical clever forwards players like Rafinha, Mahrez or players of that ilk. I'm sure there are others but that is the sort of profile of player who will do well at Chelsea I'm fairly sure now. Especially because they dont stay wide and block wing backs getting into forward positions.

Problem is, I can't see Havertz potting 20+ goals in a PL season and that's one of the things the Chels need if they're going to get past City and Liverpool. Then again, you could gift Tuchel Lewandowski and Tuchs would figure out a way not to use him. Tuchel's system of playing not to lose just won't get it done. I don't believe Chelsea will EVER get past City and Liverpool with Tuchel as manager.

[Sparked_26]

Problem is, I can't see Havertz potting 20+ goals in a PL season and that's one of the things the Chels need if they're going to get past City and Liverpool. Then again, you could gift Tuchel Lewandowski and Tuchs would figure out a way not to use him. Tuchel's system of playing not to lose just won't get it done. I don't believe Chelsea will EVER get past City and Liverpool with Tuchel as manager.

I think Havertz will be a good goal scorer 15-20 sort of zone. Which is fine if he plays the role well but he is definitely not the problem.

Others will need to contribute. That isnt happening. I dont think Pulisic, CHO, Werner and even Ziyech are good enough to play for Chelsea personally or at least a Chelsea with pretentions of a title challenge. Sample size is big enough now - they have all been middling to poor really on average. They're basically all pretty crap in terms of their Chelsea careers. Realistically none of them can feel like the important players.

Of those Pulisic was in hot form before his tore his hamstring in the 2020 cup final - so I dont know if he has more grace - then again I cant see anything in him anymore. He's lost explosiveness and is physically surprisingly weak. He never used to be so weak but this season he is easily shoved off the ball.

Chelsea wont sell all of them but really if they can even sell apart from Havertz and Mount all those forwards are available for transfer I'd think.

Werner and Puli might attract buyers. Ziyech is 'older' at 29.

CHO is just ****, ****, **** average. Mitigating cirucmstance of a ruptured achilles tendon. But I dont see a top 10 premier league footy player there. Also on a 150 k a week long term deal. If I'm him I'm keeping quiet and collecting those cheques. If he leaves I honestly dont know where he goes. Someone like Soton for half the salary if that. Soton could get a better player than him.

[BodiesInFlight]

Out of curiosity, which manager in world football do you Chelsea fans believe will make you better than arguably the best two teams in world footy right now in Pool and City?

[StarshipTrooper]

Out of curiosity, which manager in world football do you Chelsea fans believe will make you better than arguably the best two teams in world footy right now in Pool and City?

Didn't Conte win a PL title with Chelsea? That's a start. At this point having Lamps back would be better than this crap. At least Lampard played to win instead of Tuchel's "strategy" of play for the 0-0 draw and hope to grab a cheapy or two off set-pieces.

[BodiesInFlight]

Didn't Conte win a PL title with Chelsea? That's a start. At this point having Lamps back would be better than this crap. At least Lampard played to win instead of Tuchel's "strategy" of play for the 0-0 draw and hope to grab a cheapy or two off set-pieces.

Love Conte at Spurs. but he ain't as good as those two i mentioned.

Man city and Liverpool are just better teams right now. Doubt any manager changes that at Chelsea for a prolonged period.

You bettered both at the Champions league anyway, its about as good as you can get.

Lampard lol.

[StarshipTrooper]

Love Conte at Spurs. but he ain't as good as those two i mentioned.

Man city and Liverpool are just better teams right now. Doubt any manager changes that at Chelsea for a prolonged period.

You bettered both at the Champions league anyway, its about as good as you can get.

Lampard lol.

Champions League is a consolation prize. Win the PL or you haven't done shlt. And yeah, I'd take Lamps over Tuchel. I think Tuchel belongs down in Tier 2.

[BodiesInFlight]

Champions League is a consolation prize. Win the PL or you haven't done shlt. And yeah, I'd take Lamps over Tuchel. I think Tuchel belongs down in Tier 2.

Depends on the team. Most big clubs don't view the CL as a consolation prize.

Be careful what you wish for with getting rid of Tuchel. He's good.

When Lamps was your manager he made Ole Gunnar Solkjear look like prime Rinus Michels when you played lol your nuts.

[StarshipTrooper]

Depends on the team. Most big clubs don't view the CL as a consolation prize.

Be careful what you wish for with getting rid of Tuchel. He's good.

When Lamps was your manager he made Ole Gunnar Solkjear look like prime Rinus Michels when you played lol your nuts.

You can't draw you're way to a title. I'll take a manager who plays to win over a manager who plays not to lose every time. And most of those big clubs play in leagues with little to no competition. Premier League title >>>>> Champions League.

[Sparked_26]

Tuchel is a world class manager ffs.

That said maybe the first leg vs Madrid is one he has to take on the chin.

Chelsea were put out by what really looked for most of the tie a pretty inferior Real Madrid team.

The narrative might be that Chelsea bravely fought back or whatever because of the reputation Real have. Truth is Chelsea have better players and should be beating a team like that over 2 legs.

That international break for whatever reason caused a reset.

City absolutely slap that Real Madrid team they're mediocre. If they were in the prem they'd be in the clutch of teams beneath Chelsea struggling for 4th.

Chelsea could have defended this champions league imo. Chelsea, City or Liverpool are winning that competition for the foreseeable. Well, unless we get Kroenke'd by new yank owners I suppose