Langford vs Greb

[QueensburyRules]

Yes, I know, but what I don't know is if his grandfather's name was Berg. Names were changed then, and changed in boxing. Like I said the name Harry " Berg " is a ***ish name and the ***s initially placing him in their hall of fame makes me wonder if he was. Not that it matters.

- -Thought Greb was a variation on Grubb(Grub.)

Used to know a Grub.


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[JAB5239]

Greb Coat of Arms / Greb Family Crest

The surname of GREB was a German occupational name for a digger of graves or ditches, or an engraver of seals. The name was derived from the German word GRABEN, meaning to dig, to excavate. It was also an Ashke****c ***ish occupational name for a grave-digger. The name has many variant spellings which include GRABBE, GRABERT, GRABNER, GRABER, GREBERT, GREBER, GRABARZ and GRABARCZYK. The name has been anglicized to GRAVER. Surnames are divided into four categories, from occupations, nicknames, baptismal and locational. All the main types of these are found in German-speaking areas, and names derived from occupations and from nicknames are particularly common. A number of these are ***ish. Patronymic surnames are derived from vernacular Germanic given names, often honouring Christian saints. Regional and ethnic names are also common. The German preposition 'von (from) or 'of', used with habitation names, is taken as a mark of aristocracy, and usually denoted proprietorship of the village or estate from where they came. Some members of the nobility affected the form VON UND ZU with their titles. In eastern Germany there was a heavy influence both from and on neighbouring Slavonic languages. Many Prussian surnames are of Slavonic origin. A notable member of the name was Christian Dietrich GRABBE (1801-36) the German dramatist, born in Detmond. A precurser of Realism, he wrote powerful tragedies on the lives of 'Don Juan und Faust' (1822) and 'Napoleon' (1831). Hereditary surnames were originally imported from France into England during the Norman Conquest of 1066. Because of the close relationship between the English and German languages, some Germans are able to transform their names to the English form just by dropping a single letter. Many Germans have re-spelt their names in America. After the start of the first World War, Germans in great numbers Anglicized their names in an effort to remove all doubt as to their patriotism. Afterwards some changed back, and then during World War II the problem became acute once more, and the changing started all over again, although not with as much intensity. Many immigrants from Germany settled in Pennsylvania.

[JAB5239]

- -Thought Greb was a variation on Grubb(Grub.)

Used to know a Grub.

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almost the rxact same family crest.

[Dr. Z]

The surname of GREB was a German occupational name for a digger of graves or ditches, or an engraver of seals

And which ethnic group were know to be employed in such field? The would be the ***s until others field open in Germany such as business, merchants, ***eler's, lawyers, doctors and the like. As anti semitism (spelling ) rose the many of the ***s population moved out of Germany until the age of Hitler when many were them we killed in Genocide. The USA open its door to them.

[Dr. Z]

More info on Greb's fouls. Read page 159 of this Greb's book " The Fearless Harry Greb " and remember authors are usually kind to their subject material.

[JAB5239]

More info on Greb's fouls. Read page 159 of this Greb's book " The Fearless Harry Greb " and remember authors are usually kind to their subject material.

"I do not believe Greb is deliberate in his violation's"

Thank you. You have just proven my point that Greb was not intentionally fouling, which in turn means he wasnt a dirty fighter. I've said all along Greb was a rough fighter and it would be foolish to think fouls would occur given his style. But to be a "dirty" fighter you have to be looking to intentionally hurt your opponents with intentional fouls.

I have this book put away somewhere. I'm sure I could use it for its wealth of information but I've been going by memory and internet searches.

[Willie Pep 229]

More info on Greb's fouls. Read page 159 of this Greb's book " The Fearless Harry Greb " and remember authors are usually kind to their subject material.

Good find. Got to say two things . . .

1. Billy Gibson is never a good source. He has a history of infamous behavior, sometime illegal. Enough to make him a beneficiary in Arnold Rothstein's will. That in itself says much about a man's character, not good. LOL

2. As the book says he just jumped camps. Of course he would start bad mouthing Greb. Got to take that POV into consideration.

But looks like a good read I may hunt the book down. Thanks.

[JAB5239]

Good find. Got to say two things . . .

1. Billy Gibson is never a good source. He has a history of infamous behavior, sometime illegal. Enough to make him a beneficiary in Arnold Rothstein's will. That in itself says much about a man's character, not good. LOL

2. As the book says he just jumped camps. Of course he would start bad mouthing Greb. Got to take that POV into consideration.

But looks like a good read I may hunt the book down. Thanks.

It's an excellent book, one of my favorites. Paxton did a great job with it.

[Dr. Z]

"I do not believe Greb is deliberate in his violation's"

Thank you. You have just proven my point that Greb was not intentionally fouling, which in turn means he wasnt a dirty fighter. I've said all along Greb was a rough fighter and it would be foolish to think fouls would occur given his style. But to be a "dirty" fighter you have to be looking to intentionally hurt your opponents with intentional fouls.

I have this book put away somewhere. I'm sure I could use it for its wealth of information but I've been going by memory and internet searches.

No I did not, the fouls happened frequently and refs gave warnings and other fighters clearly complained about them! Norfolk for sure. A few fighters did. Whether or not they were accidentally I could buy that if they happened just once. But they happened multiple times. Again why would the boxing hall of fame says he is dirty and refs meet with Greb to make sure he wasn't so " free wheeling. "

I don't not recall saying this! Where did I say it? I have unearthed a lot of information about his fouling ways.

[JAB5239]

No I did not, the fouls happened frequently and refs gave warnings and other fighters clearly complained about them! Norfolk for sure. A few fighters did. Whether or not they were accidentally I could buy that if they happened just once. But they happened multiple times. Again why would the boxing hall of fame says he is dirty and refs meet with Greb to make sure he wasn't so " free wheeling. "

I don't not recall saying this! Where did I say it? I have unearthed a lot of information about his fouling ways.

Of course you did. You have proven even Tunney's own people said Greb's fouling was unintentional. Thank you!!

Refs give warnings all the time. Why wasn't he repeatedly docked points and disqualified?

Using Norfolk who was disqualified five times and thumbed Greb so violently he lost eyesight is hardly worth mentioning. If Greb were intentionally dirty there would be fighters saying such.

You keep reverting to the boxing hall of fame. Like you they probably believed the myths told in the book "Give him to the angels" that have been repeated with no solid proof. A book that was pulled and ridiculed for its blatent exaggerations. "Live fast and die young" and "The fearless Harry Greb" didn't come out until long after the IBHOF opened its doors, and to my knowledge has never edited any of its fighters descriptions.

You didn't say what? You're saying he is dirty for unintentional fouls, right? If that is the case you have to agree a guy like Wlad who clin he'd excessively and d****d himself over opponents intentionally was in fact a dirty fighter....because he did it intentionally!! You can't have it both ways. And you really haven't unearthed much. You can't find a single fighter claiming Greb as a cheat or dirty.

I've said it before and I'll say it again.....Grebs style was rough and found were bound to happen. But even Tunney said Greb was not a dirty fighter and Tunneys camp thought Greb never INTENTIONALLY fouled.